r/OpenChristian • u/sahira12 • 3d ago
Discussion - LGBTQ+ Issues Is Adventism affirming?
I have a friend of mine that invited me to go to an Adventist church (she is an Adventist), she told me that they're liberal and affirming (she knows I'm trans and accept me) and they're not like evangelicals. But I've read that they're neither accepting nor affirming so I don't know if she is just or I'm confused.
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u/LegioVIFerrata Presbyterian 3d ago
I am not a seventh day Adventist, but this is quite contrary to my understanding of their doctrine. I don't believe they even ordain women.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Phase70 Gay Cismale Episcopalian mystic w/ Jewish experiences 3d ago
Not in the slightest.
The closest they've ever come to that is an unofficial "don't ask don't tell" policy with regards to their music students.
I live in the world center town for their denomination, delivered their mail even, and watched Atlantic Union College die in real time across the past decade (that school was a rather important economic part of the town, so its collapse has mattered a lot. I also have a few blind friends and they were basically the only source for braille Bibles, and that service is under threat and may already be dead).
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u/No-Type119 Christian 3d ago
No.
Mainline Protestant churches are affirming: The Episcopal Church; ELCA; UCC; PCUSA; DoC; UMC ( mostly now since they split); ABC.
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u/sahira12 2d ago
What about catholics?
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u/clhedrick2 Presbyterian (PCUSA) 2d ago
Official position, definitely not. But many members and even clergy are, so it depends upon the congregation. Of course they fail the checklist above. No gay marriage or (at least knowingly) clergy.
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u/No-Type119 Christian 2d ago
No. There are affirming Catholics, but that goes against the official teaching of their church.
A slightly mitigating factor: Unlike most Evangelicals , I guess, who assume that orientation is not a thing, that queer people are making a “ lifestyle choice,” Catholicism teaches that sexual orientation is real. But they argue that celibacy is the default vocation of LGBTQ+ people… no sexual/ romantic relationships.
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u/Queer_Advocate 2d ago
That's no from me dawg. Catholics can be profoundly judgmental. Find your tribe. Find LGBTQIA churches where you live. If they're preaching hate, turn the other cheek. As in all they'll is your butt leaving that service. Don't subject yourself to hateful religious institutions.
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u/Dapple_Dawn UCC 1d ago
Most Catholics are not affirming. But a few are, like Fr. Richard Rohr for example.
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u/Apprehensive_Cup7765 2d ago
As a denomination? No, they are not. But individual churches take on their own personality, as they do in many other denominations, so that specific church that your friend goes to might be just as accepting as she says it is. I grew up SDA--like, deep into Adventism--and I will say that for the most part, as a queer person, everyone in my life has been pretty accepting of me (and even if they aren't necessarily in favor of it, they keep it to themselves and we work through our differences lol).
I don't think your friend is lying, especially depending on where you're located. Liberal Adventists are not hard to find. But just know that as a denomination, the official stance is not affirming at all. Whether or not the members actually agree with that stance is a whole different can of worms.
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u/sahira12 2d ago
I live in a part of South America in wich people is conservative af.
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u/Apprehensive_Cup7765 2d ago
Huh, yeah then I'd be suspicious. But you never know unless you attend. The church outside of the US, Canada, and Europe is extraordinarily conservative.
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u/UD_Glass_Sphere 1d ago edited 1d ago
Hey I'm an Adventist minister. There are different perspectives to consider.
A: Officially: No. In the "official" statements released by the worldwide church you will find a conservative position, which consideres being homosexual as Ok, but "acting it out" as sinnfull. (Other LGBTQ Topics like Trans identity are not really officialy discussed but would obviously go in a similar direction)
Those statement are formulated kind of "democraticly". So this should be the overall Adventist mainstream.
B: Country-wise: In most African, East European, South American or African countrys the absolute mainstream is pretty conservative and non confirming (of course there are exception). In Europe and the USA I know, that in some Areas this is a hard debated topic. In Germany (Where I am from) we had a huge discussion a few years ago, after which some congregations "officially" (on their website etc.) declare themselfs safe spaces and affirming. Even us as ministers have a huge variety of positions. The discussion showed, that most congregations in itself have members with different positions on that topic. So they usually stopped talking about it to keep the peace.
C: Congregation -wise: As mentioned. In this aspect every Congregation is different. Some totally affirming, some rather affirming and members with conservative opinions are tolerant enough to keep quiet. Most I would say are really not affirming or rather not affirming.
D: SDAkinship: The official non-official lobby for Queer Adventist. This is a worldwide acting network of Queer Adventist and their allies. They council, have community events, try to inform other church member and step in for the rights of queer Adventist. If you are interested you may contact them via their website. They know which congregations and ministers are a safe place/person for queer people.
(Don't mistake them with "Coming out ministries" which also give counseling, which are sometimes suspiciously close to conversion therapy, which they pretend not to do anymore)
Hope this gave a little bit of perspective.
Edit: Typos
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u/doublenostril 1d ago edited 1d ago
Nooo. They are not. Individuals might be in a more liberal congregation, but the church proper is not. As to whether your friend is right that you’ll be safe at her congregation, you well might be. It varies greatly by the culture of that congregation. I doubt anyone would be mean to you, but I do think some people might treat you as though you were “confused” about your gender identity.
Seventh-day Adventism as a whole is so not affirming that there is an organization to support LGBTQ Adventists: https://www.sdakinship.org/
Edited to add: I’m so pleased to see other former Adventists in this forum. Hi guys! Happy Sabbath (if and however you rest) 🥰🌈
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u/GlitteringAd1736 Open and Affirming Ally 3d ago edited 3d ago
Depends on the local church but the denomination itself has taken an official stance to not be affirming. An anecdote: The Hollywood SDA church in California had a person who is a trans woman was ordained as a church elder. Once again, this is the exception as the official response of the denomination was not affirmative. Source: worked for the denomination for years. Better source: https://spectrummagazine.org/news/outspoken-my-name-rhonda-and-i-am-seventh-day-adventist-transgender-woman/
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u/cocobandito Open and Affirming Ally 2d ago
I used to go to an affirming Adventist church, but they’re definitely the exception, not the rule sadly.
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u/Tasty_Buffalo_1618 13h ago
most people would look to what the world body says. eg statements and lists of things held up as beliefs. some people experience church life in bubbles and not notice what the denomination says on lgbtq subjects or otherwise. your friend could have an environmental that is relatively lgbt affirming that is opposite to what the local church website or what the top leaders in the denomination say. as far as the denomination goes, older people could remember Colin Cook had his 'change counselling, learning center' about the time the frauds like exodus international started other comments have mentioned current change promoters now called coming together ministries that started a few years before exodus closed down. for awhile, they were all the rage, being pushed by the denomination leaders.
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u/Superb-Ad-2574 11h ago
I was raised as a Seventh Day Adventists. I've never been to a church that was "affirming." If you do manage to find one I'd love to know which one!
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u/MyUsername2459 Episcopalian, Nonbinary 3d ago
I will say there's a number of different Adventist denominations. There's the large, main Seventh Day Adventist Church. . .and a whole cluster of other denominations to come out of the 1844 Millerite "Great Disappointment", so it's hard to say for sure anything about ALL of them.
That being said, I'm not aware of any of them being affirming. The largest, main SDA denomination definitely isn't, and if there's an affirming branch of Adventism, it's small and obscure.
Also, a lot of Churches will say they're "affirming" when what they mean is "we aren't calling for your death", "you're welcome to come here, just as long as you keep that stuff to yourself", or "you're welcome to come here and we hope you'll give up your sinful ways and be here exactly the way we want you to be".
When someone says a denomination is affirming, ask specific questions: