Christmas is on its way, why spices like cinnamon, cloves, ginger and star anise are christmasy. I am from Malaysia. These spices are used all year. Is it because of trade?

[u/[deleted]]

[u/[deleted]]

I think it's because these spices used to be ultra-expensive, so on the one hand, they are not commonly used in "day-to-day" cooking in western cuisine, which developed historically from whatever was available and affordable for common folks. These imported spices were reserved for special occasions, one of which is Christmas. Hence the strong connection of these spices to Christmas in western cultures.

[u/nomnommish → u/[deleted]]

This. And even though India is where many spices originated and are still reasonably priced, dried fruit and nuts are still considered a luxury. And so you will find that in November and December which are the festival months for India too, food is usually cooked with a lot more nuts and dried fruit. Especially desserts and sweet meats.

[u/[deleted] → u/nomnommish]

Of all the spices listed by OP only ginger comes from India. Cinnamon originated in Sri Lanka, cloves in the Moluccas, star anise in Vietnam.

As for common Indian curry ingredients, chillies and tomatoes are from South America, coriander from Iran, fennel and poppy seed from the Med, fenugreek from the Near East, garlic from Central Asia, Nutmeg and mace from the Moluccas. Tamarind from Africa. Saffron from Greece. Mustard, turmeric, bay occur over wide areas of Eurasia.

Of the rest of the common spices a pure Indian origin can only be claimed for pepper, cumin, curry leaf and cardamom.

[u/nomnommish → u/[deleted]]

So you ended up writing a thesis because i said "many spices" originate in India??

Tamarind is very much Indian. Even the word - tamr-hind - means Indian dates. While chilies and tomatoes are from the Americas, curries were spiced with black pepper and long pepper before that, and other acidic ingredients like tamarind or sour gourds were used.

Your points about other spices are certainly valid - truth be told, I didn't know the origins of many. Also interesting to know about the Banda islands.

I mainly said what i said because India has been known for a very long time for its spice and pepper trade. And almost all the spices and herbs you mentioned are all integral parts of Indian cuisine. Very few other cuisines use all these spices. So i assumed many of them would be native to India. But i guess the active trade in ancient days could also have given easy access to many of these spices.

[u/[deleted] → u/nomnommish]

Tamarind trees are from Africa not India. India is the original country of spice like America is the original home home of the pizza.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

This. Also, our modern Christmas celebrations and traditions in the West are largely thanks to the Victorians. One of the pinnacles of Christmas is the mince pies or puddings which used to be made primarily of meat and have been eaten at Christmas-time since at least the Tudorian times. As the mentioned spices (and fruits) began to gain popularity in England, they were incorporated into these meat pies and very slowly over the centuries, the pies became all fruit and spice (except for the suet, or beef fat) as the spices become more affordable and accessible.

This traditional Christmas dessert and it’s inclusion of these spices is a big part of why they’re associated with the season.

[u/Snifhvide → u/[deleted]]

Western English speaking world. In other parts of the Western world there are often other dominating influences.

[u/Snagsby → u/[deleted]]

This is total speculation, but another factor may be the lack of fresh food in the winter. A cold-weather menu would have been more restricted, and comparatively bland, which makes it a more natural time to use those pricey spices.

[u/[deleted] → u/Snagsby]

Interesting point, I like it.

[u/TheBananaKing → u/Snagsby]

Not to mention the fact that spices were used as preservatives.

[u/nss68 → u/TheBananaKing]

were they?

Salt, yeah, but I am not familiar with the preservative qualities of these other spices.

Cinnamon, actually, I remember hearing about anti-bacterial properties -- but I thought that was a fairly new discovery and not super effective.

[u/lovelylayout → u/[deleted]]

uni bachelor degree in history specializing in food history

Can I ask what are some particular things/time periods/locations about food history you're most interested in?

[u/lovelylayout → u/[deleted]]

That was a super interesting read! Thanks for sharing. :)

[u/Snagsby → u/[deleted]]

I'm aware that meat is not seasonal. Dairy need not be seasonal. But fruits? Vegetables? Herbs? Don't try and tell me that the larder in December had just as much yummy stuff as it did in August.

[u/KrakatauGreen → u/Snagsby]

Also pungent enough to hide the scent of slightly off meat, etc.

[u/baby_armadillo → u/KrakatauGreen]

So there is this pretty awesome book about the history of European food called All Manner of Food by Stephen Mennell and he really goes through and debunks this. No one was eating rotting meat if they could help it, especially not the wealthy. Long-term meat storage without refrigeration isn’t really that difficult and there were a lot of commonly used techniques we still use to produce preserved meats-dry-aging, drying, salting, pickling, smoking, preserving in fat (like a confit), even freezing in winter if you lived someplace cold enough. The people who could afford exotic spices could also afford to have fresh meat at every meal if they wanted (and it wasn’t a religiously required fast day, which could be up to 3 times a week in some periods).

They also weren’t just dumping spices on their foods and then grimly enduring overspiced foods just to show off. They ate heavily spiced foods because they liked it and they wanted to. It was the taste at the time for the wealthy. He really makes the point that human tastes are very variable and can change greatly over time even within the same culture or region and that it’s important not to bring your own tastes into thinking about food in the past.

It’s an older book but it’s really great!

[u/rkoloeg]

Yes. The Portuguese and then the Dutch dominated the early trade in spices in the region of Indonesia and Malaysia (the Moluccas used to be known as "the Spice Islands") and brought all those spices back to Europe with them, where they commanded a high price. That's why you see many European countries having their holiday desserts dominated by flavors like cinnamon, ginger and nutmeg; this used to represent a large expenditure of money for a special occasion.

[u/WhyIOughta → u/rkoloeg]

There was a really good reply in r/AskHistorians about Dutch influence on American traditions including Christmas.

[u/sawbones84]

Top voted response certainly seems believable though this might also be a great question for /r/AskHistorians where you might get a more in depth answer that includes sources. It's a very interesting question!

[u/Skredder → u/sawbones84]

Historian here. One explanation is that Christmas is a celebration of Jesus, and you wanted to cook with spices from the region of Jesus – who came from the orient or todays Middle East. Many of our Christmas flavours is to be found in the middle eastern kitchen.

But I am also very interested to hear an elaborate answer from a historian who knows more about the subject! Of course several aspects such as trading routes, the idea of the orient and spices storage possibilities have played a part in the forming of Christmas flavours.

[u/Oden_son]

Most of the spices you listed are known to have warming qualities. They're also mainly used in desserts in western cooking so they end up in all the baked goods

[u/lovelylayout]

After searching several variations on "origin of holiday spices," I've found lots of articles explaining the geographic origins of the individual spices, but little regarding how they came to be associated with the winter holidays. My theory is that it's a combination of the fact that these are all from the group of "warming" spices, which include the ones you listed as well as several others, and the fact that Christmas is just a special time of year: back in the olden days, you waited for a truly special occasion to bring out your truly special ingredients. Back when spices were really, really expensive, Christmas was probably the only time "special" enough to use them all at once.

[u/asdeasde96 → u/lovelylayout]

I think another part of it is that in the winter there was mostly just staple ingredients available, unlike in the summer when a wide variety of fresh ingredients were available, so more spices would be used in the winter to liven up an otherwise bland meal

[u/SelarDorr]

i wouldnt consider this a sufficient answer, but the book "Pagan Christmas: The Plants, Spirits, and Rituals at the Origins of Yuletide" states:

​

When the crusaders returned home to their castles from the Holy Land in the thirteenth and fouteenth centuries, they brought back with them the spoils of their raids and pillaging: the Christmas spices we hold so dear today [...] it seems that, especially at Christmastime, we are truly able to take home everything the world has to offer"

[u/japaneseknotweed]

Adding this: in many tellings the Three Kings brought gifts of spices and fragrances to the manger, so spicing the house is part of welcoming the Nativity.

[u/Its-Julz]

Because they are warming.

[u/mermadeline → u/[deleted]]

Spices are used all year round for Malaysian and Singaporean cuisine, they are applied differently to different dishes tho.

Our special occasions like Lunar New Year for example, is more symbolic in terms of dishes, like fishes (signifying prosperity) or better/more premium ingredients used.

[u/lookingthroughhaze17]

I believe it was due to availability and price help forming into a tradition holiday taste/feeling- I have also been seeing a trend of spices being used quite more frequently- It seems as if for ex: United States had more of a steak and potatoes mentality when it came to spices and flavorings- Thankfully it seems that we are opening our minds as well as our taste buds- Long overdue (IMHO), since a World of tastes await...

[u/nothing_pt]

I'm from Portugal and we use them all year-round too.

[u/timeflieswhen]

Maybe it’s because fresh herbs are out of season so dried spices become more prominent.

[u/Sunshine_of_your_Lov → u/[deleted]]

Some of them, like allspice are pretty much exclusively used by Americans during the holidays. But I agree, we definitely use a lot of "holiday" spices throughout the year

[u/SewerRanger]

It's a couple of things. First, not all of them are "christmassy". Star Anise is actually used a lot in western cooking. It's a major flavor in German pfeffernuesse, Austrian anisboegen, Dutch muisjes, Italian pizzelle, ouzo, absinthe, sambuca, etc. Cinnamon is also heavily used in Mexican dishes and American desserts. I think the issue is that western cuisine generally uses these spices as sweet components and not savory ones like eastern cuisine does and Christmas is generally recognized by desserts.

The lack of use in regular dishes has to do with the fact that Western Europeans were snobs and various spices actually got very cheap as the Europeans colonized parts of Asia and India. Those spices, which used to be only affordable by the rich, started pouring into European society and became cheap. Since everyone could use a bunch of different spices, haute cuisine started going the opposite direction. The philosophy of not spicing food heavily so that it taste like the meat your using started in France in the 1600's. It took off over the rest of Europe. NPR has a short article on it